Holy Spirit Question -
I seem to remember that the Holy Spirit was not active until after Jesus ascended back to Heaven. I have even heard in small group discussion a comment that the Spirit was not active in the Old Testament. It does seem to make sense when you read John 16: - "25All this I have spoken while still with you. 26But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
What do you make of the fact that in Genesis, God says He created man in "our" image? Do we not have the Spirit dwelling in us from birth?
What about:
I Chronicles 28: - 11 Then David gave his son Solomon the plans for the portico of the temple, its buildings, its storerooms, its upper parts, its inner rooms and the place of atonement. 12 He gave him the plans of all that the Spirit had put in his mind for the courts of the temple of the LORD and all the surrounding rooms, for the treasuries of the temple of God and for the treasuries for the dedicated things. 13 He gave him instructions for the divisions of the priests and Levites, and for all the work of serving in the temple of the LORD, as well as for all the articles to be used in its service.
II Chronicles 24: - 20 Then the Spirit of God came upon Zechariah son of Jehoiada the priest. He stood before the people and said, "This is what God says: 'Why do you disobey the LORD's commands? You will not prosper. Because you have forsaken the LORD, he has forsaken you.' "
21 But they plotted against him, and by order of the king they stoned him to death in the courtyard of the LORD's temple.
Genesis 6: - 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. 3 Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with man forever, for he is mortal [b] ; his days will be a hundred and twenty years."
Exodus 35: - 30 Then Moses said to the Israelites, "See, the LORD has chosen Bezalel son of Uri, the son of Hur, of the tribe of Judah, 31 and he has filled him with the Spirit of God, with skill, ability and knowledge in all kinds of crafts- 32 to make artistic designs for work in gold, silver and bronze,
I do think that what Jesus said about the Spirit is clear but these OT scriptures seem clear as well. Does anyone else get confused by this?
Instruments -
Hebrews 13: - 7Remember your leaders, who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith. 8Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.
9Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings. It is good for our hearts to be strengthened by grace, not by ceremonial foods, which are of no value to those who eat them.
I Chronicles 16: - 41 With them were Heman and Jeduthun and the rest of those chosen and designated by name to give thanks to the LORD, "for his love endures forever." 42 Heman and Jeduthun were responsible for the sounding of the trumpets and cymbals and for the playing of the other instruments for sacred song. The sons of Jeduthun were stationed at the gate.
I Thessalonians 4: - 15According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.
God is the same yesterday and today and forever. It seems strange teaching to me that instruments were clearly acceptable for worship in the OT and will be the call for all to worship at the 2nd coming but wrong to use them in between those times!?!
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7 comments:
Genesis 1:2 says "Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters." I honestly feel like this is saying the Spirit was there from the beginning. As your verses illustrated, not only was the Spirit around in the Old Testament, He was busy. I think maybe the difference is that now we can ask Him to come in and because Jesus is our intercessor through His sacrifice on the cross the Spirit now has complete access to us.
The mystery of the trinity has always fascinated me. God could not be in the presence of sin, but His son (who was Him and was with Him in the Beginning according to the gospel of John) could take all of our sins on Himself and be the atoning sacrifice so that we could receive the Spirit (who is also Him and was also with Him in the beginning). Interesting process.
On worship:
Colossians 3:17 says, "And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him."
I feel like God gave us all gifts. Playing an instrument may be one of those gifts. If He gives us that gift, I don't see how it could be sinful to use that gift to worship Him.
But, I'm no scholar. I can only try to understand these things. I really believe His ways are higher than my ways, and his thoughts higher than my thoughts. :)
Thanks Theresa! I am amazed by your comments. I learn from you.
Thanks for being such a great light of Jesus!!
I can remember studying about the Spirit and it's differences between the old and new testament at one time. I don't remember what I learned though. ha.
One random thought I just had in looking over some stuff was this: I just looked at the original Hebrew word for spirit in Gen 1:2 ( that one came to my mind too) and then I looked up the Greek word for Spirit in John 14:26. Both mean breath, or exhalation of God, but the one in the John passage is slightly different and is capitalized, as if personified. Now, I don't know much about Greek or Hebrew except what I can read off of a bible program, but it made me wonder if there is something different about the name/ role change once the purpose is given? Maybe in the same form that Jesus was the Word and was alive from the beginning, but His name and sonship are personified at His birth, the Spirit too was always present and active, but recieved different attention when His purpose became to serve all believers equally. Just a thought.
Regarding instruments - well, my mom might read this. Not gonna go there. Just kidding.
You touch on some of the same inconsistencies I have grappled with for a long time. I have heard many arguments and debates, and I understand the merit behind some, but I still find a lot I struggle with, both in what I don't believe, and in what I don't feel like changing even though I'm not convicted about it (and have tried to be!). Yuck that I just wrote that, but I really do struggle with it.
Thanks for making me think about it more. It's good.
The Holy Spirit has always been there. The difference I have noticed is that in the OT, the Holy Spirit was given to certain people and I have always wondered if it was just for that time, or once they had the Spirit, they had him. In the NT and NOW, the Holy Spirit dwells IN us, not just given to us or coming upon us, but living/dwelling IN us.
Instrumental music? I'm with Heather. I don't think it's go to hell wrong, but it would bother me if I showed up at church on Sunday and there was a band.
I am curious why instrumental music at corporate worship is seen so differently than all the other worship times? I know there are songs on the radio, concerts, praise nights, visits to other congregations where instruments are involved in worship. Is it second class worship?
No, but it's not "CHURCH"! :o)
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